8CN Interview with former Pacquiao Trainer Rick Staheley

September 21st, 2009

8CountNews caught up with Manny Pacquiao’s former trainer Rick Staheley and got his thoughts about Pacquiao, Marquez, Mayweather, Mosley, Williams and more.

Rick Staheley is Manny Pacquiao’s first professional trainer and his corner during his first world title championship as a flyweight.

8CN: Good day Rick! It’s a pleasure to meet you. And thank you for giving us time for this interview:

Rick: Thank you for having me.

8CN: How did you and Manny Pacquiao met?

Rick: I was promoting in Manila. And I had a few local fighters from the area, and I went to Manila. I was having this meeting with his manager, Rod Nazario. At that time, I haven’t seen him fight. I heard he was a young fighter with 11 fights on his record and we went to Mandaluyong to see him fight Torrecampo. That’s the first time I saw him fight, the first professional loss in his career. But a friend of mine, an Australian guy told me, “Hey, check this Pacquiao kid out! He’s young and he’s good. Did he beat Torrecampo?” And I said “No. He got knocked out on the third round.” But I said “He’s gonna be a world champion”. Then I went to Nazario, and I asked him “What do you think of Pacquiao?” He said “Well, he lost his first pro fight.” But I said “Look, if I train him I can guarantee you that Pacquiao is gonna be a world champion.” Nazario said “But you can’t guarantee that.” Then I said “Oh yes, I can
guarantee that because I got a crystal ball!” (Laughs) And I started helping him out. A friend of mine, Pablo, was his trainer at the time, and he said “Sure, Rick can be his head trainer.”

8CN: Did Nazario called him back from Laguna at that time? Because I heard he went there to work as a construction worker after he lost to Torrecampo?

Rick: No. I think he did that for some time, because he was suspended for about 40 to 60 days after being knocked out in a fight. But I don’t think he has the intention of quitting boxing. He came back to the gym, and fought a tough kid in his comeback fight. And that’s how we started.

8CN: How is Manny Pacquiao as a student?

Rick: He’s a very fast learner. Like when I do punch mitts, I do the punch combinations by the numbers. I go to the gym and when I started working with him, and do a combination of things one day and then ask him questions. Then three days later or a week later, he remembers everything. Very fast learner.

8CN: How did you part ways with Manny Pacquiao?

Rick: Rod Nazario, we all went to Bangkok together, we won the world title, then everybody went back to Manila except for me. I spent some time at the Patio, for a while and when I came back, Nazario fired me.

8CN: Any reason for that?

Rick: Well, one; because he doesn’t want to give me any money. Not much money there anyway, and two I’ve been asking too many questions. Well, Bruce McTavish, a friend of mine negotiated for Pacquiao to fight, then the champion, Chatchai Sasakul for $10,000. Then Rod went to Thailand shortly after, I didn’t want Manny to fight Chatchai because I knew that the only way for Manny to beat Chatchai is to knock him out. And you just don’t’ want to send you kid out there knowing that you can only win by knockout. The fight is in Thailand and Chatchai is a Thailander and he’s one very good champion. I thought Manny is only 19years old and we still got time, and Chatchai is too fast and too good, he’s not the right guy to fight right then. And if the guy is on his game, you’ll not gonna catch him to knock him out.

8CN: But that’s exactly what happened. Manny was losing on points in all rounds when he nailed Chatchai with that crashing left and knocked him out.

Ricky: Yeah, all through out that fight, we were in big trouble. Rod was sitting there thinking it’s only gonna be a 3 or 4 round fight, Manny will just walk through Chatchai and destroy him, but the champ was giving Manny a boxing lesson. But the good thing about it was Chatchai was not 100%. He was having his own personal problems. And we got him at the right time. But I do have the feeling that when Manny catch him with that left, he’s gonna knock him out.

What happened with Rod was, he came back and he said the purse was $7,000. And I said “What happened to $10,000? The promoter had took her off, he had $10,000 on the table with Bruce.?” He said “Look Rick, the negotiations was a done deal with $7,000” I smiled and said “Congratulations” then he shook my hand and I go “Its 1998 and the WBC has been around since 1963, and you just successfully negotiated the lowest purse in the history of the WBC world title fight.” And all the smile went away. (Laughs) And then, Manny and I was there a week prior, and Rod shows up with Lito Mondehar, we were having lunch and said “The purse was $6,000” My comment at that time was “Did you guys have a good time in Bangkok last night?” (Heartful laugh) They’re not so happy with me at that time. But after that title fight, there was a Christmas party, I was not there, and Rod was telling the people there that he is thinking about firing me. He was
not yet sure at that time. But I promoted Manny Pacquiao for his next fight at Kidapawan with my friend Governor Manny Pinol. I trained Manny at that fight. But in that fight I was the paymaster because I was also the promoter. So I took my trainer’s fee right away. And Rod came to me and said “But you’re fired.” I asked “Since when?” he said “After that title fight.” So, that was it.

8CN: How’s your relationship with Manny right now?

Rick: I saw Manny a couple of weeks ago in Manila, and Solar Sports was hosting a press conference. He was asking me, because I was training a couple of guys in Australia recently and he was asking if he could spar with them. There’s one fighter, Shannon Taylor, but I said “He’s kinda big, he’s not too big for you. He fought Shane Mosley years ago at welterweight. The problem with Shannon is that he’s not really that fast enough for you.” Now, I’m trying to get another guy over, Lenny Zappa to spar with Manny.

8CN: So you’re providing some sparring partners for Manny Pacquiao?

Rick: Possibly, I mean, I got one guy who’s well fitter for him. He fights just like Miguel Cotto! And Manny sparred with him a couple of year ago too. But Manny likes to spar with bigger guys, like Middleweight or welterweight, but Lenny is just a light welterweight.

8CN: I see you’re still pretty much involved in boxing right now?

Rick: Aaaaah, kinda, every now and then I go train some fighters. Like I went over to China and trained some Chinese. And I just produced their sole Chinese world champion.

8CN: I haven’t heard of a Chinese world champion.

Rick: Yes because she’s a woman. They don’t have those many professional fighters now because just like Cuba, they’re a communist country and all they have are amateur boxing events. And just recently they welcomed professional boxing. I went over there and gave classes on how to train professional boxers because professional boxing is completely different from amateur boxing. And I also trained 4 fighters, and one of them is this girl who won the world title in her first pro fight. Yes, it was her first pro fight and he fought for the title against the three time world champion, a black girl from New York City, Alicia Ashley, she had 19 pro fights. And we pulled the upset win. Everybody who went there who watched and even the promoter watched Alicia train, said to me, “You got no chance.” But guess what? We won!

8CN: What can you say about the fight between Floyd Mayweather Jr. vs Juan Manuel Marquez?

Rick: Well, I think that Mayweather looked great. I mean, he looks scary. But in fairness, you gotta give it to Marquez for having the balls, I always say in boxing “Speed kills”, I always liked the “speedy guys” and the speed difference is unbelievable. That defense is probably the most incredible I’ve seen. Its like he never had a “2 year lay-off”. Floyd was sharp as if he never even had a 1 day off.

8CN: What about the weight difference? Marquez said he thinks that Mayweather was about 20lbs heavier than him.

Rick: I don’t think he’s 20lbs heavier than Marquez that night. I think if Mayweather weighed in at 146lbs at weigh in, he was no more than 156lbs at fight night. But you know what? The weight difference, it doesn’t really matter. All that extra weight does is brought additional power, but he really didn’t need that power. He’s got the speed. Marquez when he took the fight, I mean, Beristein knows that it was a “Money fight”. I’m guessing Nacho might even be doubting if Marquez have the chance to win that fight. He got absolutely no chance to win that fight. Juan Manuel gets in there, he was so slow, so sluggish,I mean he’s not really a welterweight. Marquez is actually a Junior lightweight. And if Mayweather is that fast with that bigger weight, just imagine how fast he would be if he indeed made the weight?

8CN: What do you think about the Manny Pacquiao vs Miguel Cotto fight?

Rick: I think it’s a tough fight for Manny. I like Manny because of his speed, but I tell you, now Manny is in dangerous waters! All these guys, Cotto, Mosley, Mayweather, they’re dangerous because they’re also fast and they’re also bigger. Manny did a great job against Oscar Dela Hoya, he did what he gotta do. But honestly I think Oscar Dela Hoya was a walking dead person in that weight that night. I think the weight really destroyed Oscar that night. If Manny could adjust to his this bigger weight comfortably without affecting his performance, I think he could still beat Cotto but not in the way he beat Dela Hoya or Ricky Hatton. He looked great in his last three fights, never lost a single round. But I tell you, against Cotto, Manny will lose some of those rounds.

8CN: So, who do you think is going to win?

Rick: I’d go with Manny because of his speed. But like I said, Cotto is dangerous. He needs to stay out there in the middle of the ring. He’s gotta box Cotto. He should not worry about knocking him out. If a knockout comes, fine. But just go out there and outbox him and stay away from Cotto’s heavy hands.

8CN: How would Manny Pacquiao fare against Floyd Mayweather Jr.? That’s what everybody is asking right now. The current pound for pound number 1 versus the returning pound for pound number 1.

Rick: Two months ago I watched a fight, Floyd Mayweather Jr. against Baldomir. And I said “Manny is much faster. He’s gotta chance of beating Floyd because he throws a lot of punches.” But after watching yesterdays’ fight, You know what, I still think Manny has the chance to win, but very very very difficult task. Very difficult task.

8CN: Who do you think could beat Floyd Mayweather Jr. right now?

Rick: You know what? I don’t know, after watching yesterdays’ fight, I’d like to see him fight Manny. Coz I think Manny has a chance to beat him. Mayweather was saying these past week that there’s no blueprint to beat him because he never lost. Nobody is unbeatable. And there’s actually a way to beat him. If you watched the first four rounds when he fought Zab Judah. One thing Manny has is he’s a southpaw. A lot of people don’t realize what a big advantage being a southpaw is fighting a right handed opponent. Tremendously huge advantage. And what happened yesterday, Floyd has a significant 6inches reach advantage. Normally he doesn’t throw a lot of jabs. He usually waits for his opponents and throws a lot of lead right hands. But he throw a lot of jabs yesterday because he knew he’s longer and had that reach advantage. And he kept Marquez at bay with it. But against a southpaw, like Manny, he’s not gonna be able to throw that many
jabs. For some reason, for a right hander to fight a southpaw, they needed to throw straight right hands, the way you beat a southpaw is with a left hook. And Floyd’s got that sneaky lounging left hook that’s very fast. That’s why I like to see him fight Manny.

Another guy I think that can beat Floyd Mayweather Jr. that could give him a lot of problems is Paul Williams. He’s tall, longer reach, southpaw, decent speed and throws a lot of punches. But to beat Mayweather you got to be in his face. If you’re fighting him right here (demonstrated a squared off guarded stance) you’re hoping that Floyd would go like this (leaning backwards, left shoulder high, a-la Mayweather Jr.) because you’re throwing a lot of punches and he on his back foot, back pedaling, Floyd loves that! And you wont’ be able to land a flush shot at him when he does that. You really want him to go like this (leaning forward with both fist up infront of his face) because that means you can be on his face, and you can put him on the ropes and you have to put constant pressure on him. You have to throw a lot of punches. Zab Judah came out in four rounds and he owned Floyd Mayweather Jr. but normally what usually happens is Floyd
Mayweather Jr. is a slow starter. And what you do is you have to put those early rounds in the bank. You have to come out there and you have to win the early rounds. Because what happens then is that, Mayweather is going to heat up and would be able to adjust. So you have to put that pressure on him and you have to be very very fast. I mean, look at that speed difference yesterday. His speed superiority sets everything up. Plus he has no fear of smaller guys. If you looked at Mayweather fight against Dela Hoya, and I didn’t think Mayweather Jr. had a good performance in that fight. He almost lost that fight, it was close and he only won via split decision. Mayweather’s just giving him too much respect. Oscar’s the bigger guy and he was worried about him. He thinks if he goes out there and box just throws his hands, he can’t lose, but you can’t out-hussle Mayweather. He’s a “pot shotter” Floyd throws ones and twos, he doesn’t throw a
lot of punches. So if Manny comes in there, throws a lot of fast flurries, Floyd Mayweather is not a big hitter, so he’s gotta get those early rounds because Floyd’s gonna come out late in the fight.

I think Manny’s got a chance to beat him and Paul Williams got a chance to beat him.

8CN: What do you think about Mayweather Jr. vs Sugar Shane Mosley?

Rick: I think Mayweather Jr. beats Mosley. I think Shane is a tough fighter. He’s fast but he’s not that fast as Mayweather. Its just that, after seeing Maywether’s performance yesterday, I think he’d beat Mosley.

8CN: What do you think about Manny Pacquiao and politics?

Rick: I think he’s going to do it. For sure. Talking to him in his house last October before he fought Oscar Dela Hoya. He said he’s plans is definitely to go into politics. I think he should wait three more year. I mean, get as much as you can out of boxing. Because if you look back at the history of the sport. And I told him “Kid, be “kuripot” (stingy) with your money”. I was no longer teaching him boxing lessons but lessons in life. He was never really good at that part. He would go out there free spending. And even his close friends were there also worried about his finances. I never wanna see him to end up like another Rolando Navarete, punched eared and broke!

He’s gotta be careful because for me, Manny Pacquiao is a brand. And part of that brand is a boxer. And as a boxer he gets a lot of money. And if boxing stops, I knew when Mayweather quit a couple of years ago, he’s gonna come back. Because I knew he’s gonna be broke. He paid his first $5M to the IRS. And even if he got $15M, if you do the Math, he still owes the IRS $6.7M, now he owes them $7.1M! He needs to pay his handlers, he’s still broke. He just needs to keep fighting. Sooner or later somebody’s gonna beat him. So, Manny’s gotta be very careful especially if he enters politics.

I might visit Manny one of these days wether he uses one of my fighters or not. Coz I got some money riding on Manny for his up coming fight. And I’ll check out if I’ll add a little more. (Laughs)

8CN: What’s your relationship with Coach Freddie Roach right now?

Rick: You know what, I talked to Freddie a couple of times a few years ago. I talked to him on the phone during the first Marquez fight. Yeah, but I don’t usually see him very often. When I go to Vegas to see his fighters fight, there are so many people around, and I’m just there as a spectator. But I haven’t talked to Coach Freddie in a couple of years.

8CN: Thank you for having us here Rick. I’m sure we’ll be seeing each other again for some more boxing discussions.

Rick: My pleasure! Anytime.